Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: We've had 700 clients in seven years. So when you're doing it so much, we help people build offers that are great every day. And specifically coaching people on how to get clients on social media with no ads. It's the number one problem, because once people have clients, there are really not that many problems in a business.
[00:00:18] Speaker B: I'm Diana early, and I've spent most of my life learning firsthand what privilege actually costs.
The legacy control, the family expectations, the guilt of feeling trapped in a life everyone thinks you should be grateful for. If you've ever wondered why having everything still feels like something's missing, you're in the right place.
Welcome to Pressures of Privilege.
Everyone. Welcome back to the Pressures of Privilege. Today's guest has had more careers than most people have hobbies. She's been an actress, a fashion designer, a food stylist for a cordon bleu chef, a Wall street recruiter, and she lived in Paris for six years before any of this.
She grew up as one of 10 kids, and her family moved her from California to Australia when she was young.
Now she's a business coach working with coaches, consultants and fractionals. But the part that brought her on the show isn't the coaching world only. It's the quieter work she does, advising CEOs, global icons and celebrities on things like crisis management and what she calls private label legacy. Someone who sits right next to power and wealth and watches up close what it actually costs. Please welcome Jeanne Amlore.
[00:01:37] Speaker A: Well, thank you, Diana. Nice to be here.
[00:01:39] Speaker B: I love that you've had a lot of careers.
You've been an actress, a food stylist, a recruiter.
And what kept. I was just curious what kept making you start over.
[00:01:49] Speaker A: You know, I never saw it as starting over. It was sort of just going from one thing to another. And I don't think I was that mindful or intelligent about it. It wasn't like, gee, I'm going to think about what I'm going to do next. I. I feel I just always just. Well, I used to just do. When I was younger and I didn't have children, I just would do what I felt like doing. And I think I maybe realized at the time that most people didn't live that way. Sure, I must have realized it, but it wasn't as if I was going to not live that way. It wasn't. It was just the way I was. And everybody'd be like, wow, you've changed. And I'm. I'm thinking, no, I have. And I'm just Sort of like trying this and then going from that. And maybe it was a little hapless or mindless, but in some ways it was interesting. And in a lot of ways I realized later on in life that people had shackles that I never had. I didn't have the shackles in my mind, except that I was very poor when I was living in Paris. So maybe the shackles of not doing whatever I wanted, but at least I didn't feel like I was doing stuff I didn't want to do, except for the part time jobs that I didn't always love.
I felt like I had to do that or I would live a life of regret that I hadn't just tried stuff. So in the end I did. I did life backwards.
And in the end, I think it kind of worked out for me.
[00:03:06] Speaker B: What was going on in your life when you built this current business?
[00:03:09] Speaker A: Well, this business was a necessity business. I was newly a solo parent and I thought, well, I have to do something and it has to be something I can do from home so I can take care of my kids. And I just wrote a list. I've always kind of been coaching people and I was a coach for actors at one point and I was good at that. And people were always asking me for advice and coaching and I thought, okay, I, I should be a life coach.
So I started as a life coach and I started getting some clients and I loved it. And then I thought, you know, actually I'm helping these people make money with their businesses. So my coach said, you're, you're actually a business coach. Like you're, you're helping all of them make money with their businesses and marketing. So I just switched over naturally again, I didn't go after it. It just was obvious that I was helping these people make money and I just started doing it.
So that was about 14 years ago. And yeah, I mean, it wasn't like, gee, you know what I should I do? It's what do I have to do? So my back was kind of against a wall when I started this business, but I knew it was the right business for me. I knew that this, this could make it, this could be sustainable. I could stay at home. And then of course, after Covid, I could stay at home even more, which has been even better.
Well, before COVID I'd gotten online and learned how to get clients online.
So that solved the problem of having to be out there networking all the time. So there definitely were periods where it wasn't a perfect business for me, but it worked. And I could see that if I kept going, I'd work out the perfect model, and I did. So it all worked out in the end.
[00:04:42] Speaker B: What's part of the perfect model recipe,
[00:04:45] Speaker A: if you don't mind sharing the perfect model? For me personally, I think everything's different for me. Sitting at home and using Zoom and using social media and getting clients without having to dress up, get in my car, drive, make appointments, and have to talk to a lot of people that might not be people that I really want to talk to.
So I feel it's very efficient how I'm doing it now. And if I do want to go out and meet people, it's because I want to go out and meet people. So it's not I have to go out and meet people because my business depends on it. That wasn't ideal for me. It felt pressurized and like I have to go out to see if there's somebody I meet that might be a client. I didn't like that feeling, and it didn't. It wasn't joyful. So now if I go out, it's because I want to meet friends or family or I want to go to a business meeting, because I just want to meet the people. And it's just much more choice of why I'm getting out of the house. It's more mindful. I think that thing of having a network all the time that some people have to do, and I had to do it beginning, that's not ideal for me.
[00:05:47] Speaker B: Do you think there's still an element of this business that is really in person, that in person networking?
[00:05:54] Speaker A: It doesn't have to be the part that is, the coaching is. I'm trying to get coaches and consultants to understand that people like driving around. It makes them feel active. I'm getting in a car and I'm driving. Okay. And then they go to the grocery store and it feels like they're doing something, but actually they're wasting time.
Okay. And if you can use the same less time to get a client and be efficient and productive, that's clearly a better business model. And I'm not saying you have to stay inside your house all the time. I'm saying when you're going to leave the house, go, because you want to go meet people, you want to go to dinner, you want to see a friend, you. You want to go to a business meeting because you just really want to meet those cool people. I certainly go to certain events where there are business people, but I am not going there to get clients.
I'M going there because I just want to hang out with them and a very different hierarchy. When you're going there because you want to meet these people and it's much more respectful because you're not sort of hoping they're going to hire you. And I hated that feeling where I had to do it. So, so yeah, I mean, it's, it's way better to be at home and do your lead generation from home using LinkedIn.
[00:07:05] Speaker B: So what are coaches doing today that you find terrible? They shouldn't do this. It's not gonna work.
[00:07:12] Speaker A: What I said, they're just spraying and praying. They're, they're just saying if I just network. And I did that for years because I didn't know how to get clients online. And that changed my life because I could just be at home, save so much time, not be exhausted, go out because I want to take my kids somewhere, go to their sport, get sporting games or something like that.
I think that they're hoping too much. They're hoping that the hope is a part of their strategy and there is no hope in business. Okay, that's a joke. I say there's no hope in business. There shouldn't be the word hope with a strategy. It's not hope. I don't hope. I'm going to take an action, I'm going to watch to see what the results are. And then you say, hmm, that did or didn't work, or it worked to a certain extent. And then you're going to take that information and you're going to test again. This is not, hopefully this is actions and the results of the actions and then taking that information and then keep going. Now that is business. But, but doing something and just hoping that they're going to do something. That's not a business and it's not a business mindset. Okay. Now, regarding me going out, yes, I will go out to high end events because there I do meet people that say, hey, I do know people. For the higher end, sure, I'll do that. That's interesting. But it's not really networking. It's connecting and there's always some dots that are connected magically. I meet somebody and they go, oh my goodness, Shan, you got to meet that person. But it's very fluid and I'm going anyway because those events are super interesting and the people are interesting and the speakers are interesting. So that's really killing two birds with one stone for, for that. That's different. That's high level connecting. Very different.
[00:08:50] Speaker B: Yeah, because you, you work quietly, with these CEOs and public figures on this legacy stuff and their crisis, whatever crises they are having. What do people with that much visibility get wrong about pressure?
[00:09:02] Speaker A: Well, actually a lot of them have no visibility.
A lot of these are people that are just wealthy and they don't want visibility and they're hiding because being visible as a next gen or an ultra high net worth individual from, you know, a very wealthy family office. So of them are because they're starting other businesses, but a lot of them just want to be really under the radar and have their privacy.
So it's, it's not, they're not always that visible and a lot of them do not want visibility. Okay. But sometimes it's pretty hard to get them to do a press release or something like that. It's like, whoa, you know, because you know, they're afraid they're going to be kidnapped in some cases and held at ransom because, you know, that happens.
So, so that's one. But then there's people that are visible because they were founders. That's a different problem. That's more, okay, I sold my company for multi millions or billions even, and what do I do now? That's more wandering in the desert. Because people lose their identity when they're all in on something. If you have a very successful company and you've been going to it for years and running it and then you sell it, all of a sudden, what is your identity? So that's more about like, what's the next chapter? What are we doing now to, to create impact or just to start another business or impact for themselves or find what their potential is.
Everybody struggles with that. It does not matter how much money you have. Everyone struggles with that, okay? But for them it's more, okay, I have all the money I need and I can buy whatever I want. Becomes more obvious. Because a lot of people, they feel that part of their problem is lack of money, okay? But I know once we all get a certain amount of money and it's not 75,000 a year, it's way more than that, okay? Where you can do really whatever you want. Like you can buy the clothes you want, you can go on any vacation you want, you can get in any room you want, you can buy the car, house, blah blah, blah, there's a point where that becomes not meaningful anymore. It's just, I could do that, okay? And that's the point where these people say, okay, what am I doing? If everybody had a lot of money, like a lot, everybody would get to that point. Sooner. But with people that don't have that, they think that it's. It's just if I had more money, I could then do whatever I want. Okay, but there's a point where buying stuff and they've studied this.
[00:11:25] Speaker B: This is.
[00:11:26] Speaker A: I forget what they call it. Something mechanism. Hedadonic. I forget what the name is, but they've studied this. That once you're buying stuff, after a while you're not getting the dope hit anymore. Like anything. It's like anything in life when you're doing something fun, if you do it all the time.
[00:11:42] Speaker B: Yeah. The hedonic set point.
[00:11:44] Speaker A: Yeah, you know it. So the point is that if everybody had all the money in the world, they would be at a point of that crisis sooner. Like, okay, I thought it was the money. I thought I was miserable because I couldn't go on the vacations. And sure, going on vacations that you love does bring joy, but if you're doing it all the time, then you're just like, okay, we're just going. It's like anything. Okay.
[00:12:05] Speaker B: It's like.
[00:12:06] Speaker A: It's like buying designer clothes after a while. Yeah. You know, so after a while, where's the meaning? Where. What are they doing with their money in their life? And. And that's a point where I can work with people. And I've had people speak to me and they're like, oh, my gosh, I'm doing so well. I love my wife, I love my kids. I have this multimillion dollar company.
[00:12:26] Speaker B: I'm fit.
[00:12:27] Speaker A: We have no health problems. And I go, but, yeah, but you wake up every morning and you wonder, what now? And they go, yeah, exactly that. That's exactly what I say to myself when I wake up in the morning. What now? Is this it? What's next? Because everybody is. It's. It's the human condition.
You don't feel like you've fully reached your purpose. And you're a high achiever as well. It's like, what, now we have everything we need, right?
[00:12:50] Speaker B: Yeah, I know some of my clients don't. They're like, well, I have everything.
And I'm running around doing a ton of admin to maintain everything I have. So everything I do is in service of what I have.
And it's like all of a sudden, their stuff is owning them.
Yeah, you're either paying bills all the time or you're managing staff and you're dealing with crises. Like, oh, gosh, you know, like, they're. The caretaker in Marbella has just quit. And all Of a sudden we have an issue over there and it's just constantly managing that.
[00:13:21] Speaker A: So that's important to.
I think about that, okay, Because I was going to buy a big house with a pool and everything. And my friend said, whoa, wait a minute. She goes, are you thinking this through? She goes, you're the person that doesn't like any extra worker management.
Because I don't. She said, you do realize, okay, that place, you're going to need a full time gardener.
You're going to have to manage the gardener. I thought, oh, that's true. She goes, that's management shows the pool. You have to, you're gonna have to talk to that pool guy every week because you let him in or, you know, at some point there's, you gotta hire them. She goes, there's that. I thought, okay, that's true. And she goes, and you know, they can do most of it, but you have to do some of it yourself a little bit. I'm like, okay. She said, and then there's, well, this place is gonna need cleaning. Every. You're gonna need cleaning lady. And then, you know, hard is to find a good one. You really want them in your home. I'm like, oh, it's true. Whenever I have cleaning ladies, they're lovely, but you know, they want to talk to you all the time and I don't have time for that. She's like, you hate talking to cleaning ladies. And you know, they always want to have a conversation about their daughter or their dog or whatever. Like that's true. She goes, I've just worked out if you do this, you're going to be miserable because you don't like extra stuff. And I thought, you're right. She said, it's not, you know, when you are buying big houses, you're actually adding a lot of work to your life. And I thought, oh, I didn't think of it that way. She said, you got to start thinking because I know you. She's my friend. She goes, I know you. You don't like to do anything. That's a wasted action. She said, you got to think this through because even if she goes, you're not going to do it yourself, but you're managing now a lot more people. That's a lot of interaction that you wouldn't have to do because you don't own your own pool. We, we have one where we live that we share with other people. So she said, do you really want to do this? And I said, no.
So. Because you're right.
And then if you buy another property. Now you have two people managing and if you're not at that property, who's managing the property when you're not there? So I agree with you. And then I was going to buy another car. She goes, do you want to buy another car? That's two cars to maintain. I thought, you're right, I don't. So that thought alone keeps me from over buying because I'm thinking of what you just said, the work involved in maintenance.
Then you have another job, which. Taking joy away because I'd rather get spare time. Because that's where the real joy is. Spare time to do things, not have more. Yeah.
[00:15:39] Speaker B: What would you do with that spare time?
[00:15:41] Speaker A: Oh, me? I mean, lots, actually. I want to go to India and help Indian women with leadership. I didn't think of this myself. All of a sudden all these random people out of the blue from different said, you should go to India. I said, this is funny, you're the fourth person that's told me that. So maybe I should just. I would travel more, maybe, but not just fun travel.
I'd probably go, you know, because I believe also that we have a duty to ask ourselves, you know, when we're dying, we have a duty to ask ourselves as we're getting, you know, did I help as much as I could have? I just got goosebumps. I think that's a really good question. Did I help as much as I could have?
I think there's a moral question and I feel it's a good question because I ask myself, am I helping? Now I have children and all that and I could, you know, use the kid card all day long, right? But you know, some people have children, do a lot more than I do. So I asked myself, am I helping as much as I could? And the answer, you know, was no, I'm actually not helping as much as I could. We could all do more, but how much are we going to do, right? How, how much? Fitting it all in. And there's no judgment there. But I truly believe we should all be asking ourselves, could I be helping in some way? Someone?
What do you feel that service?
[00:16:57] Speaker B: Yeah, well, I think some kids are brought up to put, you know, 10% away, save 10%, give away 10% and then keep the rest. Right?
Or something like that. I forget the tithing bit. I think that's where before there was income tax, I think. I think it's might maybe even the
[00:17:13] Speaker A: Bible that you're saying it is, but it's a Christian thing to tithe. And you give the 10th to 10 to the church and the poor and other people.
[00:17:21] Speaker B: So I think it's sort of ingrained in our society. And I do think people feel good when they give.
It's a feel good thing.
Yeah.
And I think, you know, I'm a big proponent of service. I think service is really important.
Where I struggle with it is I tend to overdo service to the point of neglecting myself. And that's my own issue.
I even. I mean, even in my own business, I have a problem. I give away too much of my time. And that's my big.
My big problem is that I undercut my value. And. Yeah. What would you say to me?
[00:17:55] Speaker A: I would say, okay, now here's the business coach. Here's the business coach.
It's. People are mixing this all together.
And yes, life is. But you do have to have certain boundaries on parts of your life. Like I have boundaries on me and my family life. Obviously, we have to. Right. And I have boundaries on my business. So does that mean that I coach everybody for free? No, because I have a business that is a business structure. Therefore, the business is to make money to support my family and do whatever else I want to do. So that's one sectioned off part, the other family sectioned off.
[00:18:31] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:18:32] Speaker A: There's a little bit of overlap here and there, of course, but the service part, yes, for sure, we should serve our clients. But that's an agreement. We're serving you and you're paying me. That's different. Okay, then there's the other service part where they're not paying you. Or maybe a little bit they could. But the point is, I'm talking now. When people go, you should go help, blah, blah, blah, over in India. I'm like, really? They're like, yeah, you'd be amazing. I'm like, okay, I never thought of that. But if everybody's telling me, I think I've started doing some research and I met people magic. And they're like, yes, we'd like to bring you over, and blah, blah, blah. That would be more. I'm already getting paid well because I.
People will pay me well because I'm worth it.
[00:19:16] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:19:17] Speaker A: I'm a successful person because of that. Because I never. I. I used to undercut my value, but why should I when it's a business?
And there's a thing called guilt that's coming into your business, Diana, I'll tell you right now that, oh, I shouldn't charge too much. Being worthy being. Does that make sense? Not self worth. It's different that you're not worthy. It's not self worth. It's just because I don't think you lack self worth. But it's another layer of I'm not worthy to ask for that because of X, Y, Z X, Y, Z problem that's non existent as far as I'm concerned. I just, to me that's just XYZ story you've made up. Okay. So I would say that if you feel that you are undervaluing yourself than you are. Because if you, if you weren't undervaluing yourself, you wouldn't even be thinking that way.
Okay. And, and also if you finish working with somebody and you go, oh gosh, that was so hard and I really should have charged more, then you're definitely undercharging because you shouldn't. Because then that creates a resentment and that's not healthy towards your clients. So people think they're doing a favor to their clients. They're actually not because there's underlying resentment that they're gave it away so cheap.
It's their fault, not theirs. You're the one that charged them the low amount.
So I would say you have to take radical responsibility for that and understand that you're not being mean, charging people what you're worth. You're being mean, not charging because there's underlying resentment that's affecting them energetically.
[00:20:43] Speaker B: Wow, John, I see why they pay you the big bucks.
You bring clients from 0 to 500k.
[00:20:51] Speaker A: Actually, that happened.
I just wrote about that on LinkedIn. I thought I'd better share that. We, we have done that now. We, we aren't saying every single person comes in because that's just not true. And everybody's results are different and depending on how much work they do and if they, they are coachable. But we literally did bring somebody in recently. Well, she did a year with us. She was a brand new coach. She's gotten a couple clients randomly. No, because, you know, people randomly. And she got 500k revenue in a year.
[00:21:21] Speaker B: Wow, that's amazing.
[00:21:23] Speaker A: I think so. And it was without ads or any shenanigans and it was also without burnout, because that's important too. I think that results are very important.
To give the full story of the results that we did not burn her out for her to do that. Because if that were with burnout, well, that's a different bent. We did that. But she's, you know, dying of burnout right now. That is not what we did.
[00:21:47] Speaker B: Have you ever burned out yourself chasing.
[00:21:49] Speaker A: No. You know why? I'll tell you why.
Have I worked like a dog? Yes. I mean, I was a solo parent living in New York City with a one year old and a four year old. When I started my business, it was a hustle getting through New York with strollers and play dates and classes and all sorts of stuff. Cleaning the house, you know, everything.
And I just decided that I was not going to burn out, that I don't believe in it.
And when you don't believe in something, it can't happen to you.
So did I work really hard? Yes. But I never burn out because I take a break when I. When I felt like, okay, I really need to take a break, okay. And if I felt like I was starting to feel, like, not healthy, then I would stop. I'd be like, oh, I'm thinking, feeling like I'm gonna get a flu or something.
Because I used to believe I had a belief that if I worked hard, I would get sick. And my first coach picked up on that. He said, I'm going to question that. She goes, I'm successful and I'm not unwell. Oh, that's true. So that, that crashed, that belief that I had to be working so hard that I was going to get sick. And. And I. She said, do you have a belief? And I said, I won't. And so she questioned it and I got over it and I said, okay. I don't believe in burnout because I will stop myself.
I have an interior mechanism that stops myself before I do that. I would never burn out because I'll stop and I'll take a break and say, whoa, this is feeling a little too much. I'm taking a day off, but I always took Sundays off anyway.
So I think if you have a day of rest, you have much less chance of burnout.
Okay. And I also didn't work too much on Saturdays either.
[00:23:28] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:23:28] Speaker A: I did do some. I did some work, but I knew Sunday I'm not working.
[00:23:33] Speaker B: The power of coaching. You had a really good coach.
[00:23:35] Speaker A: She was good for that. Yes.
[00:23:38] Speaker B: Was she. Was she one of those ICF coaches or was she?
[00:23:41] Speaker A: I'm not sure. She probably was, actually. I don't care. I actually. I'll be honest, you're not going to love this, but whether somebody's ICF certified or not makes zero difference to me because I've been doing this 14 years. I do have some ICF certification for leadership by accident because I wanted to work with a certain person. But people are either good at coaching or they're not. And Whether that they have a certification or not, yes, it's good if they have no idea how to coach to get a framework. Okay? But whether you're ICF or not, this argument has been going on for years. And I really don't even care whether people are certified or not. I care whether somebody is good at coaching or not, whether they need a certification for it or not. Does that make sense?
[00:24:22] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, what makes that person a good coach, then?
[00:24:25] Speaker A: What makes a person a good coach is somebody who doesn't just follow a system for the sake of it, okay? That really pulls in whatever they need to help that person, regardless of a system. So, example, ICF coaches believe that we have it all within us.
I do not share that belief.
I do not share the belief for business coaching, maybe, for life coaching, maybe. But I think there's a lot of people that have no idea of their problem or how to fix it. And there's no judgment. They don't have the insight to that. And I don't agree that it's all within you. Because if it's all within people, then why do they need to pay us to show them how to get clients?
They would already know it. It's within them. And if it's all within us, then why do people need to go to med school to learn how to be a doctor if it's all within them? And they just need to pull that out of them? So the lack of logic drives me crazy with that, because clearly any intelligent human being knows it's not all within us. If it were, we would not need universities. We would not need tennis coaches. We would not need 10 piano teachers. We would not need coaches at all. We wouldn't need to get any teachers, because we have it all within us. And it's just the job of the coach to ask somebody to pull up that knowledge they magically have, even though they don't have it. So that's my problem with. It's the all within you problematic, sort of weird philosophy that any intelligent person could say, no, that's not true. I just blew that to Smitherings, right in front of your eyes, right? So clearly it is not all within us.
Clearly.
So that's the problem, is that people get too stuck on an idea of what is coaching instead of, okay, I'm gonna listen. What's the prob. What do you need? What's missing? Okay, there's something. Whether it's a relationship or whatever it is that you're coaching on. Okay, let's just say I don't know how to get clients. Great. Well, I'm not gonna say to my client, oh, but it's all within you. Go find that.
Why would they pay me for me to say it's all within you? And they'd be like, what? John, I just paid you because I don't know what I'm doing and I need you to show me. So therefore I'm no longer really just a coach. I'm also a trainer and a consultant while I'm coaching. And so now it's like, okay, is that coaching? I don't know and I don't care. I'm here to help you see the difference.
That's the problem is ego of what am I doing now? It's too much watching yourself like just be in the present, solve the problem, darn it, just solve the bloody problem. So when you go to it that way, you're a great coach because you're not worried about is this coaching? Is it self directed coaching? Is it non directive or non directive? Who cares? Mine is definitely a directive coaching. You just saw the difference. It's not non directive of what do you think? Now clearly if somebody says something to me and it's a personal thing and it's mindset, I will say sometimes, what do you think that is?
Because they know I know they know and they go, well, uh huh. Do you think it's that? Yeah, yeah, that's what it is. Because sometimes it's better for them to come to it themselves because I see they, they do have some things within them. I'm not saying that people are, are idiots. I'm saying if somebody pays you to solve a problem, you can't tell them it's all within you. They'll laugh you out of the room. I just paid you to show me how to get clients, John. You're saying I already know. How would I know? Oh, also how would you know? Because we have trainings for you to do. If you knew, you wouldn't need to watch my video. Trainings that are trainings.
So therefore some coaching is also training and consulting. Sort of like a sports coach.
The word coach, sports coach. They're not saying to the team you have it all within you. They're saying, get your butt out there and go kick that and do this and let's fix that and let's look at the video, see what you did there. You got to change that. That's also coaching.
So I don't understand why all of a sudden when they started this thing called life coaching, they tried to Change the definition of what the word coaching means when we had sports coaches way before. Do you get my drift?
[00:28:46] Speaker B: Yeah. I worked with a writing coach once who, you know, I was trying to get my book written and I said to her, well, how do I, how do I start?
And she really had a hard time because she was ICF trained.
And, and she finally was like, all right, fine, I'll just tell you. And then she told me. Yeah. And she finally just said, whichever way it comes out. Whichever way.
Just don't edit. Don't self edit while you write.
[00:29:11] Speaker A: Okay?
[00:29:11] Speaker B: I mean, there's no way I would have known that.
[00:29:13] Speaker A: No, there's no way. And I actually question a writing coach saying, I'm an ICF writing coach. Because you can't say to somebody, we're going to write a book, but you have it with. The book is within you. Yes.
[00:29:22] Speaker B: For sure.
[00:29:23] Speaker A: The book, the knowledge of what you're going to spout.
[00:29:25] Speaker B: She didn't have a title, icf. She, she, it was for, it was in her resume.
But I, I, I felt her hesitation wanting to be directive.
[00:29:34] Speaker A: I felt right. But, you know, you needed the answer and you got it finally. But there shouldn't be a problem of identity with that. That's keeping you from helping people because of ego and form.
That's not. That to me is a problem that they're more interested in their identity of how I'm turning up as a coach rather than, what do you need? Great. You need that. Great. You want me to help you with how to negotiate that? I'll do that. Okay, great.
[00:30:02] Speaker B: You want to help with that?
[00:30:04] Speaker A: Great. What else do you need? That's a great coach. Because your goal should be helping to the maximum, no matter what it takes, regardless of whether you're going to. Don't call me a coach, then call me a trainer. I'm good.
I don't care. I'll help you anyway. But we're too worried about the label.
[00:30:24] Speaker B: Well, they have. The ICF test is like, if you advise, you fail.
[00:30:28] Speaker A: Right. That's why I don't. You, you understand why I started saying I don't care about ICF coaching? Because I believe that they're holding people back by holding back the knowledge. Because there's this forum and ego. That's a problem.
[00:30:40] Speaker B: You're like the equivalent of the Dr. For businesses combined with the coach.
[00:30:44] Speaker A: Yes. I would say that I'm a fixer and people like, oh, you don't need to fix people.
I don't need to fix people, but I can certainly Fix their problems. Of, you have a problem and we're going to solve it. I can't get clients, great, let's help you solve that. Nobody wants to hear, oh, you have it all within you and just work harder. I mean, why do they need me for that? They know how to do that.
That's why they're so frustrated, is because they don't know what to do and they're desperate. Some people are like, I just don't know what I'm doing. I'm like, that's totally fine. Let's help you with that. Let's go through and show you how to do this. So. So, yeah, I mean, does it matter what you call me? All we care about is, is that person going to help me or not? And if so, I'm convinced of that. I'll pay you money for that. That's the crux of the matter.
[00:31:31] Speaker B: So going back to your really successful client, the one that got to 500,000, did you have to spend a lot to get that?
[00:31:37] Speaker A: No, we don't teach ads at all. I'm the organic Queen, they call me. Okay, so we teach people to get clients with no ads. That's, that's the kicker. No ads. We are not showing people ads. Ads are broken. They don't work. This was all, this was a very high profit. All she had to pay was for our coaching. That was it. And to use sales navigator on LinkedIn. So she got all of that on LinkedIn with no ads. We do not teach ads. They do not work.
I know because I have tried a lot of ads. So that's kind of what makes us different, is that we are organic.
That's amazing.
[00:32:12] Speaker B: What, so did you only use LinkedIn as well?
[00:32:15] Speaker A: I started on Facebook there, then I learned LinkedIn and then I learned Instagram and I was using all three.
[00:32:23] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:32:24] Speaker A: Recently Facebook and Instagram are very hard to get clients on. And I actually don't want those clients anymore. They're not my market anymore. My market are people who hang out on LinkedIn who are high achievements, achievers, a lot of them coming out of corporate. So we've raised who we work with even higher that. That I don't even want those. So it's made my life much, my business much more streamlined because we, we cut off two marketing avenues and actually did better last year than any other year doing one marketing avenue.
[00:32:54] Speaker B: Wow, that's so cool.
And, and it. In that sort of high performance, high achievement bracket, what would you say is the one thing, the thing that they're
[00:33:04] Speaker A: Working on the one problem we're solving, the main one. There's other things we coach and we coach people on, you know, how to get on podcasts, how to get speaking gigs, how to sell from the stage, we do other stuff, start their own podcast, blah, blah, blah. But the main thing, people all need clients. Everyone, that's, that's the problem.
So easy and clear for us to solve. It's not a vague problem. It's like, I need clients. Very simple what we do. Great. We're going to show you how to get clients. So the biggest issue is not knowing how to get clients, right? Knowing how to use LinkedIn with no ads to get high ticket clients. And you know, we teach people how to sell with, you know, with integrity as well and the whole messaging thing. So we're teaching people how to use it without being spammy or weird or using a bot, because nobody likes that. And it's not about a system and bots and spamming. It's about being real on LinkedIn. And when you're real on LinkedIn, the cream rises to the top. People say things like, wow, John, I get messages all the time, but you're the only one I want to talk to. And I know why.
Because we're not spamming and throwing things at them. And watch, read my article. And so people are mindlessly using things not well, just because they think that's the way it's done and then they're just going to throw some mud at walls. Oh, it's not working. And there's again, you have to have an awareness of being in the moment and using things well.
It's mastering good communication.
[00:34:32] Speaker B: You know, you're so clear about what your client is battling, what they want and they, it's just clear.
[00:34:38] Speaker A: It's one thing. We've had 700 clients in seven years. So when you're doing it so much like we, we help people build offers that are great every day, you know, like 700, just any human being when they've done something so much better be good, right? You, you, you better get good at it. So it'd be pretty pathetic if I weren't good at this at this point, after coaching for 14 years and specifically coaching people on how to get clients on social media with no ads. So yes, we are very clear because I've spoken to thousands of people who are consultants, coaches, fractionals that are just struggling to get clients. It's, it's the number one problem because once people have clients, there are not many. There are really not that Many problems in a business because you have cash flow, you're good, you can afford to hire people.
It really is the number one problem is they cannot get clients and you don't have clients, you do not have a sustainable business. So clearly that's, we'd have to fish far for that one. We'd have to look that hard. We know that's the problem.
[00:35:44] Speaker B: So what are fractionals? You mentioned earlier that you work with, you work with coaches, consultants, fractionals.
[00:35:49] Speaker A: Fractionals is a growing group of people. Like, like say you need a COO or CEO, but you can't afford to have a full time CEO, cfo, coo, bookkeeper, whatever.
You get a fractional, so they work for you some of the time. Okay, so the fractionals are kind of like consultants in a way because they're not hired as a full timer. So let's say I want a cfo, but I, I can't afford to have a full time CFO because I'm.
Then you could get a fractional CFO and they'll, they'll be able to get several clients.
So sort of like consulting that's a fractional, it's growing a lot because people are understanding they'd rather share a cfo, a coo, as the, you know, there's fractional project managers as well, because they, you understand, they don't need the person in house all the time. They just need to have them come and do, you know, 10 hours of work, work a month or something like that. And usually they'll do it like that. It's just like part time, but they're not on the actual payroll, so they're free. Just kind of like consulting in a way.
[00:36:52] Speaker B: It's interesting. So you have this French background and for some reason I have this impression that like American marketing and sales stuff is a little bit more icky. Like the, the Europeans don't really like that kind of marketing.
[00:37:07] Speaker A: Yeah, they don't.
They don't. But yet it's so funny when you get like a French person, for instance, doing marketing, it just often they do it so poorly. It's worse than Americans. It's, they say they don't want to be spammy. I'm like, oh, how is that, that you're more spammy than us? Because maybe it's so unnatural. I mean, let's face it, European companies market. They're marketers, right?
I know German coaches who are very successful and they are very good marketers and they're, they have no problem. Sell, sell, sell.
Okay. I personally don't want to feel that I'm being sold to. Yes, we are being sold to. We know we're being sold to. But I don't like this feeling of I'm like on the hot seat and they're trying to, like, catch me. Nobody likes that feeling, the high pressure sales technique.
[00:37:57] Speaker B: Like, oh, you know, this offer is going to be gone tonight at midnight. You better buy it tonight or else it's.
[00:38:02] Speaker A: Yeah. Or even, like, even the pressure of we really want to close you and you, you feel that and it's like, oh, okay. And they're all nice, but, you know, they're just like wanting to get their number. And it's really uncomfortable for me because that we don't sell like that. It's more like, okay, we'll fit. Let's see what you want.
You know, what do you want? And my thing is we need to just ascertain what does that person want? Can I get it for them or help them to get it? If the answer is nope, we can't help you, I'm not going to sell you. I'm going to say, you know what? I don't think this is a fit. I don't, I don't think this is going to work.
But, yeah, you want that. Yeah, I could see that working. Let's see what you're doing. Ah, you're not doing many things that would work okay. This would work. I've evaluated.
[00:38:41] Speaker B: I'm.
[00:38:41] Speaker A: I'm pretty good, actually.
I know exactly when it's going to work or not. After that many times, you just know.
Then I'll say, okay, this will work. Really? Yep. You want to hear about it?
[00:38:52] Speaker B: Sure.
[00:38:53] Speaker A: Tell them about it. Do you have any questions? Yes. Answer the questions. Do you think this will work? Yeah, I do.
[00:38:57] Speaker B: Do you want to do this?
[00:38:58] Speaker A: Yes, or I really think this work and I don't want to do it. Then I'll say, okay, why?
You know, like, what's the problem? Usually it's money, you know, so then there's some objection to work through if I've already figured out they really, really, really want to do it. But some people try to sell somebody that's not even a real prospect. For want of a better word, I would say not even a real interested party is a better way to put that.
[00:39:24] Speaker B: So how do you know you've got a really interested party?
[00:39:27] Speaker A: Well, I mean, they're like nodding and they're like, yes, I really want this. Yes, John. Oh, do you think this would work? Yeah, I do. Do you want to do this? Yes, I do. Well, that's an interesting party. Interested party?
Yes, I want to do this. Yes, it's going to work. I love it. That's an interesting.
I don't know. That's not an interesting party that you got to stop then. Folks like you can't sell somebody to be them, to have them be excited about it. If they're not, you gotta know when to just say, yep. You know, I don't think this will work. No. No offense, you know, it's great, but I don't think we're a fit. And they're like, yeah, I agree. And usually they're pretending it's not gonna work with me because they don't wanna invest because people are very.
Some people are very professional and they know it's gonna work and they're gonna do whatever it takes. And those are the people that are higher achievers. Other people like, well, I don't know, I could spend that money on vacation. Those are not high achievers.
That a business is an investment.
You have to invest in a business. And they don't know that a business takes investment. Then they don't know the basics of running a business.
[00:40:29] Speaker B: Do you meet with your clients often when you work with them?
[00:40:33] Speaker A: We have a group one on one model.
So we have. I have other coaches, I have a whole team. We have five of us that are dialed in.
And apart from the group, we have unlimited one on ones. We don't count it.
So that. The answer is that depends how much they need. Some of our clients really don't need a lot of one on one because we do such a great job in the group. And also they can text me whenever they want.
So that depends on the client.
[00:40:58] Speaker B: So you're not doing it per hour?
[00:41:00] Speaker A: No, no. And we, we help people get away from that model. Are you doing an hourly model?
[00:41:06] Speaker B: Yes and no. It's based on an hourly model. But I've, I've had it. I've added it. I've added more time to it, you know, to accommodate those, those texts and those emails and those. Extra fun.
[00:41:17] Speaker A: Okay, good. Yeah. It should never be presented as an hourly because in a sense, you have a job and you're working for them.
[00:41:22] Speaker B: Okay, but what's the difference then?
[00:41:24] Speaker A: The difference is just create an offer. You create an offer and the offer has a price on it. It's an offer, it's a program, it's a, I don't know, a package. It's an offer. Rather than we're going to work and you're Going to pay me X amount per, per hour.
You could work that out for yourself. But they should never be told it's an hourly thing because you are. They're paying for results, not minutes. Does that make sense? I'll repeat that. People pay for results, not minutes.
I want results. I don't want to pay for minutes myself. I don't care how much I pay somebody if they get me results. I want a result and there should be a price on it and I'll pay that.
[00:42:00] Speaker B: Right.
[00:42:01] Speaker A: I don't care about how many minutes they spend because then they'll just spend more minutes with you and waste your time because they're always spent more time with you.
[00:42:07] Speaker B: Maybe that, that per hour model comes from the like some life coaches being like therapists in a way without dealing mental with, without dealing with a pathology. They're, they're, they're for those clients that aren't mentally ill, maybe have slight depression, just need somebody to talk to or
[00:42:24] Speaker A: it's to show value. I spent an hour on the call.
Well, let's just question this. Nobody questions this. I'm glad you brought this up.
So would you rather get on a call with me for 10 minutes and I sort the problem out and then you go sort it out, okay, in 10 minutes or would you rather spend a whole hour just to make sure I spent an hour with you where we really didn't get what we needed?
[00:42:50] Speaker B: No, I'd rather spend the 10 minutes.
[00:42:52] Speaker A: That's what high achievers want. They want the answer. Yes, I want the answer. I don't care how long it takes for you to dispel that to me. I love. Just give me the deal. So when you're doing an hourly thing, your people are getting you for your time.
So regardless of whether it works or not, they're paying you for your time. There's, that's broken. Because it should be motivating that you're going to get the result you need no matter what. We don't care about the time. That's why we give unlimited one on one because I don't care.
You might need more, you might need less. Makes no difference. We just want it to work. And that takes away the counting per minute and counting in general. When you're counting, it's not a good thing to count, count affection and like count a minute. We have a generosity based model where you're just gonna get whatever you need to get the result you need.
[00:43:41] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:43:41] Speaker A: And they say okay, great. Then nobody's worried about like being needy about. I wanted the hour I got this. It doesn't matter because you didn't. You didn't get what you needed. Sure, let's book another call then. Whatever.
[00:43:53] Speaker B: Do you ever have clients who just call you all the time?
[00:43:56] Speaker A: Well, they don't call me. They're not just allowed to call me and get on a call because I have a schedule like everybody else.
[00:44:00] Speaker B: Right.
[00:44:01] Speaker A: But, you know, they have to book a call. But they can. They can certainly.
They can message me whenever they want, and I will go back and forth and lead, and that's great because they don't even need to get on a call. They can get an answer from me without getting on a call. Okay, so we move it forward, and then they. They need a call. Great. But no, we don't. I'm not like an open thing, and everybody would just call me when they want. That would be disrespecting my time. But they can message me whenever they want, and I will go answer that. We are there, and it works because I don't care. I like people asking me questions. I want to be. I'm a. I'm a helper.
[00:44:38] Speaker B: That's my.
[00:44:39] Speaker A: My personality. I want to. I want to help.
So I feel weird if I said to my clients, oh, don't message me at night and only message me here. And. And a lot of coaches have such strong boundaries.
[00:44:50] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:44:52] Speaker A: But it's just for the sake of the boundary, because I really don't care if somebody messages me on the weekend. If I'm. I'm not free, I won't answer it. And when I will, I will. So there's no ego attached to this. And a lot of coaches have this real ego, the boundaries, and like, wow, why are you so scared of your boundaries?
[00:45:06] Speaker B: Right?
[00:45:07] Speaker A: I'm not scared. I know very well if I'm busy, I'm not going to answer it on a weekend. If I'm busy doing something else, they're not going to go, why didn't you answer me? And da, da, da. Well, actually, I was at Broncho. I was doing. No, they just know I'm going to get to it when I can.
[00:45:21] Speaker B: Right.
[00:45:21] Speaker A: It's reasonable. Okay, so what you want to do is you want to serve people, but you don't want to be too tight. No boundaries. But you also don't want to just say, sure, call me any time of the day, because that's on. That's just ridiculous. And not going to work. Right.
[00:45:35] Speaker B: You're just going to call me.
[00:45:37] Speaker A: You have to set that up or. Or leave me a message and I'll just answer without a call. So we worked it out that it works beautifully, actually.
And we also have group calls and they get a lot of help in those calls. So, yeah, I think that, you know, I think that it's just too petty the way people are thinking about things in general in life. Just give them what they need without counting. It's sort of like, well, you did me a favor by Anna, so now I owe you a favor and you bought me that. So now that's very counting. And in relationship also, that's not good, right?
Well, you're right. A relationship with our clients is a relationship. And if we're nasty and mean and you only get this, and I did that for you, that's not a good energy. Would you agree?
[00:46:20] Speaker B: Totally. Yeah, no, it's. It's cool. I have a quick question to close. If someone's listening to this and, and someone has money or power but feels stuck or isolated, what's one thing you tell them?
[00:46:36] Speaker A: Well, first of all, when I first, this is the deep work, I, I work with intuition and then order. That's intuition. And orders you get intuitively. So I. The first thing that we do is we ask the question, what do you truly want?
Or what do you truly desire? That's the first question. The answer you get usually is not the right one at first. This is a question, this is not a yes or no. And this is why when I first work with people, I fly anywhere in the world and spend a week around them and they can just meet me whenever they're free. And we just have conversations and get deeper and deeper. And that's not the fixing part. That's just like, what are we dealing? What do you really want? And there's a lot of realization when you just keep talking to somebody and asking questions over and over in different ways. So it's not this getting or then we get a plan. It's like, oh, that's what you really want. Then it's like, ah, then you can see, oh, actually that's not my purpose. And I thought I wanted that.
You see this opening of like relief, Ah, this is it. Then it's full steam ahead. How do we engineer that happening, whatever that is in their life? Okay, so it's not going and fixing. It's first a lot of questions and asking and you know, I'll come up with ideas and. But it's not all within them. It is a bit, you know, within them, their desires. I'm not going to tell them, but Sometimes I'll have an intuition and say, well, what about this? And they're like, oh, my gosh, that's it.
That's what I want to do. I'm like, are you sure? Yes. Okay, let's start talking more about that.
[00:48:20] Speaker B: It's interesting when, when I first introduced you, on one side you do that business for, you know, business coaching for coaches and consultants. But this other work with your, your private label that is more of like what you would call the, the typical ICF style coaching.
[00:48:39] Speaker A: There, there. I wouldn't call it icf. I would call it intuition, intuition, conversations. But I'm going to go fix it after that.
I'm not going to fix it. I'm going to help them fix it. Okay. And I call myself the fixer. And everybody's like, oh, you don't want to fix people? No, I'm not fixing people. That's just what I call it. Right. But it's, it's definitely advisory. Advisory means you're advising, you're not just sitting back.
[00:49:05] Speaker B: Right.
[00:49:05] Speaker A: So there is, it's a mix. That's a mix. We do need the intuition part, actually. One founder said to me, said, you know what's interesting? He said, you have two sides of your brain that work very interestingly together. I've never seen this before. He said, there's the intuition and the order and you go from one to the other. He said, I've never seen anybody do that before. That's from my artist brain to my money making business, you know, client getting strategy brain. It's the two. And I've managed to meld the two parts of my life together.
Finally, Hallelujah. Which has been great for me to feel like, you know, I'm using my whole, my whole being now.
[00:49:50] Speaker B: Yeah. All your skills, which do you like better?
[00:49:53] Speaker A: I like it all because it's all of me together.
It's, it's all together. And even with my clients or business clients, I'm using intuition as well. But I'm not saying, what do you think? And it's all within you. I've never said that before about marketing ever to a client because I have a lot more experience than them. And I'm going to say, well, I found this. Why don't we try this? And they're going to experiment, but I'm still going to say I've done this, this, this, this and this. I think this would work because that's called experience.
And when you have experience, you can help other people more than not having experience.
[00:50:25] Speaker B: The, the kinds of Coaches that you work with, are they all business coaches themselves or.
[00:50:29] Speaker A: Absolutely not. No, we've had like I, I have a business broker that wants to work with me because that's sort of a consultant. We've had all types of consultants, innovation consultant. I had a California state judge that was a decision making consultant for businesses, relationship leadership executive, all sorts of men coaches for men to perform better, performance coaching, crypto coaches. But mainly it's more on the leadership executive business that want to exit their business coaches like, like exiting coaches. So it's been a lot of different coaches. But no, actually right now maybe I have one or two business coaches in there.
[00:51:14] Speaker B: Wonderful. Well, this has been really, I've learned enlightening and I've learned so much from you. Sometimes I ask this of people because you're so good at self care. I can tell you're able to know when to stop working. When you start to feel tired.
What is your morning routine like?
[00:51:32] Speaker A: Okay, I've switched morning routines and so it's sort of like in between. It depends.
[00:51:38] Speaker B: So.
[00:51:40] Speaker A: But okay, what, what my morning routine is. I do a morning mindset and I used to do a very long one before I was pretty successful and it really helped me a lot. And then I thought, okay, I was a bit bored with that. So the morning routine is I, before I. This is something I do every day before I get out of bed. I do this thing called the instant shift technique that I, I created from various things. And basically I address all the icky feelings in the morning before my gratitude. Okay, so first before we go to gratitude, we have to address the wake up. You know when you wake up and there's like a, like something's not like I actually think, okay, what's that feeling?
Why am I feeling icky? Oh, it's that thought. Ah, that's what it is. Okay, and then what else is there? Oh, I'm also a bit upset about that. Okay, there's that and then, oh, there's that going on. And sometimes it's five things, sometimes it's one.
[00:52:33] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:52:33] Speaker A: Sometimes it's none. But usually there's one little thing.
Like yesterday I was like, dang, there's like seven things that are bothering me right now. Like seven various things. I thought, well, that's a lot. So I actually absorb each one. Okay, that's. Yes, that's how I feel it in my, in my chest. Usually I go through them. On I go. Okay. Yep.
[00:52:48] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:52:48] Speaker A: Okay, great. Now I do a shift where I do a certain type of breathing and I Shift it. And I literally get myself to a state of neutrality about the feeling I have about that.
So that I get out of bed, not all upset about stuff. I get out of bed grounded, that I have neutralized my emotions towards all the icky wake up in the morning problems that we wake up with before I step out of bed. That's the first. And then I pray and I Sometimes I meditate and sometimes I'll go for a morning walk. And I have actually a little list here. This is what I sometimes do.
You can't see that. But number one, meditation. Number two, gratitude. Three, journaling about something that was pleasant or a good experience, thanking somebody and then happy Cardio, such as 15 minutes of cardio that I like. This is actually a list I got from a happiness expert called Sean Accor. He writes about this. So sometimes I do that plan. So I like mixing it up and not doing the same thing every single morning. Except for the instant shift technique.
[00:53:51] Speaker B: So pragmatic. So boom, boom, boom.
[00:53:53] Speaker A: I love it.
[00:53:54] Speaker B: Not no indecision.
[00:53:56] Speaker A: What I'm not doing is the same thing every single morning like other people. So maybe that's bad, maybe it's good. But I think I would get bored doing exactly the same thing every morning for every single day of my life except the internship and praying. Those are the two I do every morning.
[00:54:11] Speaker B: Thank you so much, John.
And I hope. I hope to run into you sometime.
[00:54:16] Speaker A: Yes, I'm excited to be here and thank you for interviewing me.
[00:54:20] Speaker B: Yeah, you're welcome. It's. Thank you for being on the show.
If this episode landed for you, share it with someone who might need to hear it.
[00:54:31] Speaker A: And if you haven't already, subscribe so
[00:54:33] Speaker B: you don't miss what's coming. But here's the real thing. I want you to know if you're carrying something you can't talk about, if you have every resource except someone who actually understands what wealth costs. I work one on one with people like you navigating exactly that. You can reach me@diana oehrli.com.
[00:54:54] Speaker A: thanks for listening.
