Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: That's how I'm looking at the world now. Let's not be fragmented. Let's bring things together, bring different disciplines together. You know, you can't just do yoga and expect to always be well, because there's so much more to life than just doing yoga. If your PH balance is out or you have parasites, then it doesn't matter how much yoga you do, you know, you won't necessarily be the best you can be.
[00:00:23] Speaker B: I'm Diana Earley, and I've spent most of my life learning firsthand what. What privilege actually costs.
The legacy control, the family expectations, the guilt of feeling trapped in a life everyone thinks you should be grateful for. If you've ever wondered why having everything still feels like something's missing, you're in the right place.
Welcome to Pressures of Privilege.
So my guest today spent 16 years as a London broker, then walked away to build an entirely different life.
20 years in Phuket, raising her children outside the school system and creating an organic Thai herbal program sold into luxury spas across Asia. Then her mother's decline through Alzheimer's brought her home and reshaped how she thinks about aging and dignity altogether.
Today she lives in Pembrokeshire, Wales, renovating a seaside cottage and building arc vitae, a practice built on what she calls intelligent longevity. Not living longer, but living well.
Wonder, curiosity, dignity and emotional vitality. I've been looking forward to this one, Deborah.
[00:01:37] Speaker A: Thank you, Diana. Thank you for inviting me. It's really nice.
[00:01:41] Speaker B: Well, you're welcome. Well, I am so glad that I've found you.
The world of LinkedIn.
[00:01:46] Speaker A: Right, I know. Is that how you found me? It was directly through LinkedIn, was that.
[00:01:51] Speaker B: I think we're connected through.
Through people who are in the same space and who are.
Who are interested in longevity but, you know, in well, in well being and living well. And then I started reading your wonderful posts about really being in the moment and enjoying your surroundings.
[00:02:13] Speaker A: And
[00:02:15] Speaker B: to me, it's the antithesis of the online world.
[00:02:19] Speaker A: I know, I know it's very difficult. LinkedIn is a very unusual place, isn't it, really? You know, you have a very wide array of different points of view.
And of course, longevity is one of those words that, I mean, 10 years ago it wasn't a thing like wellness. 20 years ago, wellness wasn't really a word people spoke of. So it's been interesting for me to, to sort of watch how things have progressed in the last 20, 30 years.
[00:02:50] Speaker B: Yeah. How would you say the word longevity has changed?
[00:02:54] Speaker A: Well, it's become a buzzword which is quite interesting because I think it's what most people. Well, I don't even know whether people thought about it before it became a buzzword. And everybody became so obsessed with, you know, stacking and biohacking and all of those things. We just either lived long or we kind of didn't. I don't think people gave it as much thought as we do now.
[00:03:20] Speaker B: Yeah, I have grandparents who lived to be in their mid-90s. They never talked about longevity.
[00:03:27] Speaker A: It wasn't a thing, was it?
[00:03:29] Speaker B: No. They would say jokes like, if things are hurting after you're 50, that means you're still alive.
Be grateful you're still around, you know.
[00:03:38] Speaker A: I know, I know. What are you going to do next? You know, that's what my, my mother used to say. Well, what are you going to do now? I go, I don't know yet. Let's see what happens.
[00:03:47] Speaker B: Well, that's a really good segue into sort of the introduction. You know, you spent the 16 years as a broker and you've, you know, then you were 20 years in Phuket. How did like the question go from, you know, what's next? What are you going to do next to how do I live this?
[00:04:03] Speaker A: Well, I kind of got to a position in my life where I was looking at everything and thinking, is this it? To be honest, I mean, it was a very simple question. I just woke up one morning, looked out of the window and I had everything that I had aspired to have.
I had my beautiful home, I had nice neighbors, I had six Arabian horses because I'm a horsewoman. I had a successful business, I had a husband, I have two children at an amazing school.
Most people would probably be happy at that point. And my, my awful question to myself was, is this it? For the next 30 years, is this all I'm going to do? Just do the same thing, like this wheel that, you know, I'm here in this rarefied air, but what, what next?
So I turned to my husband, ex husband, I have to say, is now. Poor guy, I dragged him around the world and I said, if we didn't do this, what would we do? What would we be doing? Because he was also, I, you know, he was the managing director of the finance company, the leasing company that we had.
And I think flippantly, he said, buy a bar in Tonga.
And so I know, and it was one of those early dial up days with, you know, the Internet. So I just typed in bar for sale in Tonga and there was a bar for sale for, well, it was a mermaid bar.
And I said, how about this? And he said, yeah, okay, why not?
And then it took us 18 months to wind unwind our life, you know, because I had to get rid of six horses and we had to sell the house and we had to think about what we were going to do with all our furniture. And, you know, I wasn't worried about the children's education, I have to say, because I've always been one that education is not just about school, it's about life.
And we managed to get to the point and we did everything, got rid of everything, and then we left and we went to America first, to Santa Monica.
I think that's a place that the uk, they always kind of think, oh, that's a nice place. It's sunny.
I was surprised how cold it was actually in the evenings there.
But I didn't feel that it was as much an adventure as I was looking for.
So we then went to Western Samoa.
And that to me was really incredible because I saw groups of families all swimming together in rivers and the grandmother is there cooking on the little stove.
And it really touched my heart. And I thought, this is more what I'm looking for.
So we stayed in Western Samoa for a while. Then we went to Tongo and we looked at the Mermaid bar and I thought maybe not.
It was a lot more basic than I imagined.
And we stayed on a tiny little island in the middle of the ocean. And, you know, in the evenings I could hear the whale song, which was pretty phenomenal.
And I started educating our children, which was very interesting. My son was quite stubborn. My daughter wasn't, you know.
And then it got to a stage where I was like, I don't know whether I can stay here for the rest of my life either.
So the next. Well, actually I'm. It's a little bit embarrassing. I was watching the Hob. Not the Hobbit, the.
What's it called? With when. When they're in the Shire.
[00:07:41] Speaker B: Okay, so this is still part of this. The Tolkien series.
[00:07:44] Speaker A: The Tolkien, that's right. And I. And New Zealand is where it was filmed. So I said to my ex husband, why don't we go to New Zealand?
So he said, okay, so off we go to New Zealand. And we did about 6,000 miles from top to bottom in a camper van with the two children in the back.
Sudden it was a bit crazy at times. You know, we did all hot springs and we met loads of amazing people, but I still didn't think it was for me, you know, it still felt almost like Wales, to be honest. New Zealand.
And then we, we went to Singapore and I fell in love with Singapore. I liked the order and the discipline.
So I learned something about myself at that point.
And then my. I said to my ex husband again, so what do you want to do now?
And he said, well, why don't we buy a boat and live on a boat? So I said, okay, well, I found this boat Internet again and it was in Phuket. So we flew to Phuket and I got off the plane and everyone smiled. And that's what really sold it to me, the fact that as soon as I looked at anyone, they just beamed. And I felt, wow, this is incredible.
So, And then Kokkum Kah Hong Nam Yuti Ngai is one of the best ones because that's. Where's the bathroom? That's a really important.
I learned that one very quickly.
And then we found a house and I put the children into school. It was a British international school. Incredibly superb education, Very Chinese in the way that the education standards were so very, very high, much higher than the uk.
And then I thought, well, what am I going to do now?
I think I probably had that on my tombstone actually. You know, what am I going to do now? And I had put on a lot of weight. One of the reasons I'd left broking is because I got very stressed, very sick. My hair was coming out, I had psoriasis on my, on my neck. I'd been to the doctors in Singapore. They said I had an 87% chance of having a heart attack.
So I knew I had to change my life, you know, and this is, this is kind of the whole thing started with like, I have to change my life. I can't just stay in this position.
So I, I then set about finding out how I could make myself better.
And I'd become a British herbalist for just, just for something to do in my spare time, you know. Broking was. I loved it, don't get me wrong, I really loved it. But I am a gardener as well.
So I found a Thai Chinese, the first, the oldest herbalist shop in Phuket town. And I got talking to the gentleman who owned it, and he was 93rd generation Thai herbalist.
And I sat with him for a year every day. And we took tea and we looked in the. When, when there was a word I said, he'd have to look in his little tiny book. And you know, he said, oh, you mean this?
And I produced herbs for myself.
And the Thai ladies are Very blunt.
And so I'd been doing my program, and I'd been on a raw food diet, and. And obviously I was beginning to look different to what I had when I arrived. And so the Thai ladies was like, oh, madame. You know, you arrive, you're pompui, which is basically fat now, suai, which is beautiful. So sexy. I'm like, okay, well, I'm obviously doing something right. You know, the women are noticing.
And then I had six women say to me, we want to do this. Um, so I took them through the program, and one of them lost 10 kilos in 14 days. I'd already lost all the weight, and my skin was so much better, my eyes were better, my energy came back.
And then I met someone else who was spa director for Six Senses. And she introduced me then to Sonu, who was the CEO at the time.
And he took my program away because I then created a program because my broker brain had switched back on. You know, I was like, right, how can I make money now?
And he took it away, and he came back to me three weeks later, and he said, deborah, I love this. I've lost 7 kilos, I've reorganized my life, and I want it in all my spas.
So it was, oh, here I am again. You know, I'm at that point where I'm kind of in business again. I didn't think I was going to do that, but that's the way it kind of went. And then I sold into Six Senses, Four Seasons, a lot of boutique hotels for 17 years.
[00:12:49] Speaker B: Oh, wow.
That's how I now remember how I met you or found you was through Antonis, who was a yoga. No, he's. He's a massage therapist from Gstaad at the Six Senses Spa in Gstad.
[00:13:02] Speaker A: Ah, really? Yeah.
[00:13:04] Speaker B: And you're. We're common friends. That's how I found you.
[00:13:07] Speaker A: Amazing. Okay. Yes.
[00:13:09] Speaker B: He was awarded top massage therapist in the world of all the six census.
[00:13:14] Speaker A: Yeah. Wow. They're a great brand. They're. You know, I don't know what they're like now because, you know, I. I kind of went with Sonu when he set up Suniva, and I still dealt with Suniva Fushi and three. Three properties in Thailand. But when they moved and they were sold, you know, new people come, and I kind of didn't pursue, you know, I just stayed with Sanne. Really?
[00:13:41] Speaker B: Wow. Well, part of the thing on LinkedIn that I loved reading, and this is a little bit of a segue into your family was you've written about your Aunt and. And her hats and her mattress. And she was 93.
And what did she understand about aging? That the longevity world just keeps missing.
[00:14:01] Speaker A: Well, you know, I was thinking about this today, and I was. Got quite emotional, actually, because she was a very interesting woman. She, in the 50s, was taking Americans to Egypt. She was taking them to the Himalayas. She worked for American Express and Bales Tours.
And she'd always come back and she'd bring me a gift, so I'd have a little elephant or, you know, some flag from the Himalayas and the prayer sheets. And then one birthday, she bought me an atlas.
And that really made the massive difference to my life because I studied it like a bible. You know, I knew geography, and then that led to history.
So she was a very big force in my life. And I remember her saying to me one day, she said, you know, Deborah, she said, you must always have something to look forward to. She said, it doesn't matter how small, but you must always have that thing just a little bit ahead of you.
And I think that was her longevity. I think that's what kept her going till, you know, she had glaucoma. She lost her husband to cancer, and she continued going to the theater, to matinees three times a week, even though she could hardly see.
And that was her thing, you know, just always have that little bit of thing to look forward to.
I love that.
[00:15:25] Speaker B: I always have something like, you wake up in the morning and you're like, oh, I'm looking forward to this thing on my calendar today.
[00:15:30] Speaker A: Yes, exactly. Exactly.
[00:15:32] Speaker B: No matter how small, right?
[00:15:33] Speaker A: Yeah, no matter how small. Even if it's just a massage with the best masseur in the world.
[00:15:38] Speaker B: Yes. Actually, I've never tried him. I need to try it. I think I would have tried it.
[00:15:43] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:15:44] Speaker B: It's also a tai chi practitioner, and I've been wanting to do that with him, too.
[00:15:47] Speaker A: So, yes, Tai chi is excellent. I've got quite a few friends who are very high up in the Tai chi world. It's an amazing discipline.
[00:15:56] Speaker B: My thing is Shotokan karate.
[00:15:59] Speaker A: Oh, wow.
I've not heard of that one.
[00:16:02] Speaker B: It's a bit like karate. It's a bit like Tai chi, but a bit faster.
[00:16:06] Speaker A: Ah, yeah. Tai chi is quite slow for me.
[00:16:08] Speaker B: So caring for your mom through Alzheimer's also shaped how you think about aging and dignity and how much of this new project that you're involved in. They are. Vita vitae grew out of that experience.
[00:16:22] Speaker A: I think probably about 50%, because, you know, my background for the last.
Well, really since 2004, has been full time on wellness, luxury hospitality training spa teams to understand wellness. But I hadn't thought about longevity. You know, I was just doing my life.
And then my mother, she fell over and so I came back immediately. I was living in Mallorca at the time because my children live in Mallorca. And she was still so feisty, but she was.
She couldn't really move, you know, And I began to think, what's the point? In many ways, if you're an invalid or all your friends have died, you know, your partner's dead, what is there? And then my aunt comes back in and saying, we'll have something to look forward to. So with my mother, I used to write short stories for her and play them out.
And so I give her her role. She was always Agatha Christie, Ms. Marble. I was always the villain, of course.
And so we used to do these little plays.
And then she got sicker and sicker, and then the dementia really, really came on and she lost the use of her legs. But she was still, in many ways, so sharp. She never forgot who I was, but she forgot other things, you know, like, she'd say, I was never married.
And I'd show her her wedding album and she. She was hilarious. She'd say to me, wow, I am so beautiful, aren't I? Look at me, I look fantastic. And I said, yes, Mum, you were so beautiful. Now I'd show her photographs of. Of herself. And I kind of began to think then that how important it is to have that connection, you know, to have that legacy of the past, to not let it go, you know, to always feel I was that once, I might not be it now. And she used to pick her skin up on her hands and go, look at this. It's disgusting. And I say, oh, you're still so beautiful. And she'd say, no, I'm not. Prove it. Prove it. And, you know, we have phone filters. I'd put a filter on and I'd take a filter, a picture of her, and I show her, and she said, I can't believe it. She said, I look 40.
I know, mom, you're incredible. And that made her live a lot longer, I think, than if she'd have just been on her own.
And that kind of brings it to the whole Blue Zone and the science that they've done on Community, because I don't know if you're familiar with the
[00:19:01] Speaker B: Blue Zone at all. I met Dan Buettner, actually. Yeah.
[00:19:05] Speaker A: And, you know, the study was incredible.
It wasn't the food, it wasn't the water.
It was community.
And I'm a real advocate for families not letting their elderly just disappear, you know, so, yeah, that's. I feel very, very strongly about that.
And then I kind of arc vitae was, well, how do we achieve that?
You know, how do we actually have certainty of self?
That was important.
[00:19:37] Speaker B: Talk about that, the certainty of self. What does that mean?
[00:19:41] Speaker A: Well, if you don't know yourself, then you. You're almost like flotsam and jetsam, aren't you? You know, you're like seaweed wandering in the ocean. But when you begin to know yourself, you can actually build a base upon that.
So if you lose everything, if everything disappears overnight, I mean, you know, we never know what might happen. But if you have certainty of self, then you can always go within yourself to actually feel safe.
And so how do you know yourself? Well, you begin to understand your biology.
That's really important.
So this is why I brought in daughter Hummel, who is a remarkable specialist in not longevity, but in biology.
So she works with NFL players, and she's just won a contract to go to Dubai and work. She's actually will be in charge of their whole training and medical department, and she's on the faculty.
So she's my biology part. Because you've got to know your own biology.
You've gotta know what your body wants, what it doesn't want. You know, if you have an intolerance to avocado, then you need to know you have an intolerance to avocado, because all the time it's slightly poisoning your body as you're eating it. You might love it, but if it's not good for you, it's better to know.
And then the next question was, well, that's great, but what about psychology? You know, what about the grief that we carry from.
Not just grief of someone dying, but we carry grief from things that we didn't do when we were children or pathways that we were going down and it changed because of someone else.
And I always remember the Citizen Kane movie, you can remember that, where his thing was, Rosebud, I believe the sledge was called.
And that really always stuck with me because no matter how much he made or what he did, the most important part of his life and what he remembered the most was that sledge and going down the hill. And that was one of his happiest times.
And that comes down to psychology. So that's when I brought Ava Yakonsala into the program.
And then for me, I. I'M very much focused on identity.
So when once you have those two pillars, then really it comes together then with me as to, okay, so what next? You know, what next? There's my word again. Centers again, what next?
And so you can gain certainty of self by understanding yourself on a biological, psychological and identity level.
[00:22:28] Speaker B: Ah, so is this something that happens during those 15 days, during that 15 day journey I across the four countries is something that the participants actually learn or uncover?
[00:22:41] Speaker A: Yes, it is, but it starts before then, because we start two and a half months before because obviously all the data that we have to collect is really important.
And I kind of see those 15 days as almost like the practical.
You know, you've got all the information and it's it.
People can get this information. They don't need to do the journey for the information.
But when you're doing it at home, you've got all of the problems at home. You know, you're doing whatever you normally do, the people in your lives and you're not, you can't always focus on yourself.
So those 15 days are yours, nobody else's. They belong to you.
And it goes in a kind of. It's like this, not a roller coaster. That makes it sound a bit too dramatic. But for example, Morocco, the Oberoi in Morocco is a very peaceful place.
So you start off in peace. So you arrive, you put your bags down and you begin to think, okay, this is strange. You know, I've come to an abrupt stop.
So that's kind of how Morocco unfolds. We're going to a bird sanctuary. You know, that's not a normal wellness activity, but to me, that is wellness. That peace with nature is the start of really being able to listen to yourself.
And we have cookery lessons as well, because that's very much about how do you feed yourself. You know, it's not just about food, but how are you feeding yourself through the day? You know, what information are you taking on board? So it's a very practical, I'm a very practical person. You know, I grow herbs and I always want to taste things and touch things.
So Morocco is very much about that.
And then when we get to Egypt, it's completely different. The scenery changes, the pace changes, even the heat changes.
And I said to the girls the other day, I said, right, what I'd like to do is dune bugging and sailing.
And Ava immediately said, I am not going dune bugging. Daughter can do that one. So she said, yes, I want to do that one. So that's all about really it's about testing yourself. You know, you might not want to go dune bugging, but at least if you go sailing, then you're active, you know, you're moving, you're testing yourself. So Egypt is very much about testing yourself. You know, how are you feeling in a different environment?
So it's faster, it's active. We're going into town, we're going to be walking around the suits, we're going to be looking at fabrics. You know, it's quite girly in a way, really, because, you know, we are women and we do like nice fabrics.
And then when we get to India, the pace changes again, and it's about silence.
And those four days, I actually got goosebumps thinking about that, actually, because I've thought about this a lot. You know, I've planned it very, very carefully.
And so few people have silence. There's always something happening. Silence isn't the same as peace. It's very different.
So the four days in India, in Kajaraho, it was a Maharaja's palace temple. It's phenomenal. It's in the middle of an ancient forest, it's got a lake, and it is a very, very silent place.
And that's where the ASMI program, which is the Oberoi's Work Wellness Program, really kicks in. And they will have all of the stats, everything. And so you'll have all these incredible massages, incredible treatments. There's a Vedic doctor that also sees you while you're there as well.
And then we go to. Then we fly back to Madrid and we go to the Mandarin Oriental in Madrid. And that's very much about, we did it, girls. You know, we're here, it's fun, we have dinner, and then everyone goes back to their. To their ordinary lives.
And normally, I don't know whether you've. You've probably done a lot of retreats, but it's very difficult when you get back home to keep that momentum going. You have the best intentions, don't you? And then, you know, two weeks in, you're like, oh, no, it's. We're normal again.
So we carry on with the program for a month when the people get home, when the ladies return home. And so we're still there. So they still have that pull of, like, I remember that I was still there.
And then the question came, well, how do I actually put all this into something that can be used, not just then, but carrying on, like, for the next 12 months?
So I have a partnership with an amazing company in the uk and they have A health data bank.
So all of the records, all of your data will actually be put onto something which I'm calling the living blueprint because it's about you, only you.
It's not anybody else's information on there, it's just your records. And you're in control of it.
Because right now we are in a situation in the world where all. Everything's so fragmented. You know, you might have seen a doctor in Switzerland, you might have seen someone else over here, you might have. Your dentist might be doing this.
But to actually have all of that information on your phone because it can all be loaded up into the living blueprint. So you actually have your own living blueprint with all of your records in one place and you are in control of it.
So if a doctor in Zurich says, I need records in this, you can say, hang on a minute, I'll send you them now. And you don't have to wait for anyone else.
So that is the continuity of yourself, really.
[00:28:40] Speaker B: Well, do they get to see the data of how their biomarkers might have changed during the journey?
[00:28:46] Speaker A: Yes, yes, they do. Daughter takes kits with her.
We don't take live blood at all. It's more urine based.
But we, we update it and then in the following month when they arrive home, we also then update so they can see the progression of, of everything really.
[00:29:06] Speaker B: Do they do any blood work before they go?
[00:29:10] Speaker A: We don't do live blood, so it's not live blood. But it is a mutual. Know you prick and put it onto something and send it because it's very difficult with the postage and everything else to do the live bloods, like the
[00:29:26] Speaker B: Function health ones, I did my Function Health labs and oh my God, they took so much blood. It was like 20 vials.
[00:29:33] Speaker A: Oh no, I hate seeing it coming out. I don't know about you, but it's
[00:29:37] Speaker B: like, oh, I don't look like I go like this. I'm like, take.
[00:29:42] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. It's not always necessary. And daughter is, she's very, very thorough. And one of the frustrating things that I've had when I've had tests is that I get it and I can't even read it. It's like, well, great, I've got this information, but what now?
How do I even build my life upon this sort of dot dash this, that and the other.
So what daughter does is she puts it into language that is easy to understand and so you can build upon it.
[00:30:15] Speaker B: That's wonderful. And obviously the, the. The package includes the transportation via private jet, which I know, Wonderful. Because traveling right now, traveling, like with airlines, is not fun. They cancel them.
They're crowded. Long, long security lines.
[00:30:36] Speaker A: Well, that's the other part of this journey, you know, because if you have friction, you have stress, so we want to take all of the friction away.
So if you. If you say, I don't want to unpack, then the staff at the Oberoi will unpack for you.
You know, if you want to say, I only want to bring a carry on, then we'll organize for your luggage to be sent direct to the first property. Because there's nothing worse, is there, than dragging your suitcase anywhere.
A small carry on is absolutely fine. And in fact, to the point, I only take a carry on, even if I'm going for three weeks, I'd only take a carry on. I'm so organized with my packing now.
And so it's all concierge all the way along. And Gary from Bartlings jets, he's been in the industry for 20 years, and he's phenomenal.
So. Yeah. And he's actually the only man. He's coming with us, which. Ooh, I know, I know. Well, I. I don't know whether he feels that lucky about it. I think he. He's almost terrified. But he's very, very professional, and he knows exactly what he's doing. And he does this. This is his job. He's just finished doing a tour where I think it was Americans, and they were 17 of them, and it was by private jet, and they went to various different countries, and that's what. That's what his business is. So he has it so incredibly well organized. The jet itself is from Austria, so that picks us up in Madrid, flies us to Morocco, and then it flies us all the way back again to Madrid. And we have a tour operator, an American tour operator based in New York called Adventure Women, and they have been trading for 20 years. And they just deal with ladies who want to go on trips, you know, whether it's friends or just you're on your own. And they organize everything.
So they will literally organize if you say, well, I want to go, but I have no flight. Can you do that? They do all that as well. If you need a car from your property to the airport, they do everything.
So we've removed all friction. Well, hopefully away from everything. And there are spa treatments. You know, the spa treatments every other day, but that's not really the thing. There's yoga every day. There's the gym as well for those people who want to do the gym.
So we We've pretty much thought of everything, all the foods included. We don't have alcohol apart from the first and the last day.
But you can drink alcohol if you want to, but we just don't provide the alcohol.
[00:33:22] Speaker B: I like that. I was going to create a mastermind with exactly that policy.
[00:33:27] Speaker A: I mean, it's fine if people want to drink, it's up to them, it's not a problem. But you know, we're encouraging them not to. In a way they can keep their phones with them if they want to. You know, you. Some, there's some places they go and it's, it's so strict, you know, it's like phone in the bag before you even enter this sacred zone.
That's not reality.
You know, we, we don't want to put restrictions on people. We want them to find their own, their own path, their own zone and to look within themselves. It's like, what do I need? What do I want now?
[00:34:00] Speaker B: And then get the community of the other women. There's how many women? I think 12, I read only 12.
[00:34:05] Speaker A: Yes, yes. And I think the, the age group as well because, you know, I don't really want to go to a retreat where there's full of 25 year olds. You know, they. What am I going to talk to them about? I'm going to have to take myself out of my space and put myself into their space. I wouldn't expect them to join me as a, you know, 60 something.
Oh, I shouldn't really say that, should I? Mum's kind of. Anyway, I have no problem with being my age. When I was looking at the target market and I was thinking really about, you know, myself and my journey and I thought, well, you know, what happens to a woman when her husband just dies?
You know, who, who is she? She's there and her whole identity collapses.
You know, everything changes and it's really tough.
And then who is she when she's just got divorced? Because often friends take sides and, you know, she doesn't really know what the next step is.
And I think when you're in your 50s and your 60s, it's and 70s. I mean if someone's 85 and they want to come on this trip, it's not a problem. You know, we don't, we're not ageist. In fact, we welcome them, we'd love it.
And then I kind of thought, well, what if someone's just sold their company and they'd been working for 30 years and you know, they, they've been so passionate and they've got up every morning with something to do and now all of a sudden they might have all the money in the bank, they might have everything they need in the world, but it's still, what am I going to do now? And the empty nester. Yeah, I used to laugh at empty nesters. I used to think, this is ridiculous. I can't wait for my children to be older and they'll leave home and I'll have all my time. It was like my limbs had been cut off. I was just so shocked with my reaction.
And it took me quite a long time to really find my own identity. And I wandered around the planet. I have to, you know, I. I went. There was one, I think it was 2005, I think it was last year than the year before.
I literally went to about eight, nine different places and I'm. I was sat in cafes thinking, what am I doing here? You know, I'm in beautiful situation, but what am I doing here? Why am I doing this?
So I think those. That, that type of woman is kind of at. At that stage where she's like, what next?
[00:36:31] Speaker B: You also write about wealth as a transfer of values, but not just assets.
And I think a lot about stewardship in my own work. So I'd love to explore where you think longevity and legacy meet. Like, what are we trying to carry forward? You mentioned your children and how the empty nest syndrome is real.
[00:36:53] Speaker A: It's a difficult one, isn't it, really?
I think it's.
I guess the thing that comes to mind is belonging. It's terrible to be estranged from your family.
And that, that really is. Is a legacy that I would hope that I've passed on to my children. That family is strong, you know, no matter what happens, your family are the ones you can turn to. And it's not. It's not really about money, is it? You know, and that brings me back to Citizen Kane, because he didn't have that. He had a legacy, but he had nobody to give that legacy to.
And what are you really working for if it's not to give something to the next generation so they can be happier, their life is what, easier? Or their life is more fulfilled.
So, I mean, that's how I see it. How do you see it?
You probably have more experience than me.
[00:37:53] Speaker B: I see stewardship as not owning something, but as sort of taking care of it for the next generation or for future beings on this planet. So we have to take care of first of all our own bodies so that we can do this work of stewarding but we also have to steward our planet and we have to steward whatever wealth we do have because, you know, having, you know, wealth to, to allows us to do good things philanthropically or so it's sort of, you know, this idea that we cannot give from an empty cup. I love that, I love that.
That African proverb, beware of the naked man who offers you his shirt.
And I love that because it's. There's so many people who love, love to give advice who, who are so good at pointing their fingers at other people. But then when they're, you know, they,
[00:38:49] Speaker A: you know, you point.
[00:38:50] Speaker B: They always say, if you point your finger at someone, there's three, you know, fingers pointing back at yourself.
Or is that person walking the talk? Is that person doing what they recommend? It's sort of a reminder. How can you be a philanthropist and give money away in a. In a good way if you're not taking care of yourself?
[00:39:09] Speaker A: Well, you can't. It's very difficult because you're tired.
And if you're tired, it's very difficult to give, even if it's just to make someone else a cup of tea. If you're tired, it's very, very hard to do. So they say on the airplane, don't they always put the mask on yourself first?
And I think that really stands for everything, because if you're fit and healthy, like my aunt, I mean, she, she would do all sorts of wonderful things. She used to make marmalade. That was one of her.
And take it to the wi. I don't know whether you're familiar with the WI Women's Institute. The Women's Institute, yes. And we have that in the uk and all the ladies, you know, they take all their baked goods to the Village Fate and people then buy them and it goes to charity. So it's just, it's a small step.
But if you don't have the energy to make the marmalade, then you can't take it to the fate.
[00:40:07] Speaker B: I was also thinking about how, you know, how every dog. I'm a big dog person, even, even the sweetest Labrador in the world, if it's got an ear infection and somebody pulls its ear, it's going to bite you and it's going to be painful and it could disfigure you, actually.
But lab, you know, so if, when people aren't feeling good there, it's, it's. And, and they could become like that sick Labrador with the, the ear infection, and if you poke in that exact spot, they might be not so so
[00:40:42] Speaker A: kind and not so generous with someone and not, yeah.
[00:40:46] Speaker B: And not their best selves. So I, I, I have this feeling like I, I, I heard this, this guru Sadhguru on, he's a guy on, he's one of these, you know, sort of thought leaders on, on the Internet. And he was saying, somebody asked him, well, would you, would you work with wealthy people? And he said, well, why not? They have a lot of resources and they have a lot of power and why not help them get better because they can do good in the world. And somebody said, he said, even Trump. And he's like, yes, I would love to help Trump because he feels better, he's going to do better things. And I'm like, wow, that's, that's what a wonderful idea.
[00:41:25] Speaker A: It's, it's true. Absolutely, absolutely. I think Trump would definitely benefit, you know, I would definitely help Trump detox without a shadow of a doubt, make him feel better.
[00:41:36] Speaker B: Because if he's feeling better, the whole world benefits.
[00:41:39] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's, and being in the position of that much power is incredibly stressful, you know, and you have people around you that might have agendas and if you, the more foggy your own brain is, the less likely you are to be able to understand what's right and wrong, you know, and it might be something just as simple as, as your micro mitochondria is off and so you balance it or your PH level's wrong. The PH level is really interesting for me. I've done quite a big study on it. And in the UK we have a saying is she's got an acid tongue. Have you heard that one?
[00:42:17] Speaker B: I've heard it's somebody who's very sarcastic, right?
[00:42:20] Speaker A: Sarcastic and unpleasant, you know, Unpleasant, really? And they say an acid tongue. And it's really interesting because the more acidic you become, the more bad tempered you become.
So if you balance someone's pH, they immediately change. And you can balance someone's PH in a day and in a second, actually hugging someone balances someone's pH.
So simple, really simple. And I think that going back to the longevity industry, one of the things I think about with them is they're confusing life with living a long time and it's better to die at 80 and be happy than it is to die at 100 and be miserable.
And so have people be hugged, you know, get your hands dirty in the soil and plant some vegetables. And you know, actually on that subject, I read something the other day, how soil has a microbe inside it that if you get it under your fingernails, it actually helps the serotonin in your body.
I mean, who would have ever thought
[00:43:31] Speaker B: that I'd go put my hand in the dirt?
[00:43:34] Speaker A: Maybe that's what Trump should do. Just do. Do a bit of digging.
Yeah.
[00:43:38] Speaker B: Get off to McDonald's food. I don't know why he glorified that. I know he's very patriotic, but.
[00:43:45] Speaker A: Yeah, it's not good food, though. I mean, we know now because it wasn't. There was that guy that. Did he. He did. He didn't eat McDonald's for, like a year or. And he was terribly sick, you know, and it's. It's. It's sad because it doesn't have to be like that. You know, we. We. We don't have to have bad food. We don't have to have poor soil. But don't get me on that one, because, like, that's a whole nother podcast of me standing on my soapbox, you know.
[00:44:13] Speaker B: Well, it's part of the whole stewardship, you know, concept that I'm. I'm very focused on. It's. We need to take care of our planet, because if we don't take care of our planet, our air, our water, our soil will not be able to sustain us or selfishly in a. I
[00:44:28] Speaker A: know it's our children. I mean, just the war that's happening, you know, never mind the feeling around the world over it, but the quality of air with all the pollution that's being caused from it, you know, it wasn't that long ago they were telling us not to use plastic straws. All of a sudden now, you know, people are breathing all the fumes in from all the debris and the bombs and everything else, and we live in a goldfish bowl.
So, you know, the oceans are affected by what people pump into them. And I hope the younger generation. I feel the younger generation are different. I feel that. I don't know about you, but I feel that they won't put up with it. You know, they're much more aware than we were.
[00:45:19] Speaker B: Yeah, I think a lot of them are mad at the older generations for not taking care of the planet for them.
[00:45:25] Speaker A: Yeah, Boomers kind of have it quite bad, don't they? They're. It's criticized, but, I mean, I am kind of not quite a boomer. I'm a Generation Jones, and nobody seems to have ever heard of Generation Jones. Yeah.
[00:45:37] Speaker B: Between boomer and.
[00:45:39] Speaker A: Is it X? Gen X. Yes.
[00:45:42] Speaker B: Yeah. Boom.
[00:45:42] Speaker A: And it was only two years, but it's.
[00:45:45] Speaker B: We were.
[00:45:45] Speaker A: We were the silent Generation. But I think we were the generation that kind of went, no, this is not working for us.
And that's kind of. We. We kind of started that change because I was terribly rebellious as a child. You know, I. I was like, why are we doing that? You know, that doesn't seem right. You know, I wouldn't go along with the status quo.
And then that's quite typical, really, of me.
[00:46:09] Speaker B: Oh, but you're part of that sort of Apple generation. Apple was also not wanting to. It was. I think their. Their original tagline was about.
It was made for people who don't like the status quo.
[00:46:21] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, I think that's it. We have to, you know, mix things up a bit and make some changes. Because if Elon Musk is anything to believe, I mean, humanity will be extinct, you know, and then what will the planet be? Because nature always has a way of looking after itself, you know, But I'm not so sure humanity understands that it needs to look after itself a lot better.
And it starts with ourselves, you know, we have to make these changes and we have to understand why we do our. What we do and our motivations, and we have to find some happiness and some joy.
[00:47:05] Speaker B: Yeah.
Well, I love how you've brought together the wisdom of your aunt and the wisdom of, you know, having given your mother some really good last few years.
[00:47:16] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah, I did. I'm proud of myself in a way, because it wasn't easy, you know, it's not easy looking after someone with Alzheimer's when they're in a hospital bed, like in the sitting room, you know, and I didn't have carers for the first 12 months. And then when I did have carers, she didn't like them, so she was difficult.
[00:47:37] Speaker B: Oh, I have a friend going through that right now. She's got a husband who's got dementia, a type of dementia, and she's the sole caregiver and he refuses everybody else.
[00:47:46] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:47:46] Speaker B: It's so hard on her.
[00:47:48] Speaker A: Oh, my mother was quite evil to people. I mean, the nurses, she. She would rip them apart, you know, because she was so full of anger. She was so angry and. And she had so, so much guilt. And I think that that's why the psychology really helps, because the guilt is something that we don't talk enough about.
Sorry. Not the guilt. The grief of. Of the past that we've given up. So she would say, I wished I'd have done that. Why didn't I do that?
So she did. She had a lot of. Of grief.
Regret. Yeah.
So that's something that, you know, we can all work on, really.
And sorting out the ph helps well,
[00:48:34] Speaker B: all goes together, doesn't it? I mean, I think that's why I think Dr. Huberman is so famous. He's able to bridge the biology together with the psychology and kind of give you a reason for it in a biological sense, but also in a philosophical sense as well.
[00:48:54] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. And so many doctors are so fragmented. I mean, I'm not saying they're not amazing, but they don't talk to each other.
You know, they specialize.
I think they should all sit around a table and talk.
How do we do this? You know, that makes sense to me.
So that's kind of what I've done. I've got with two ladies who are brilliant at what they do, and I've brought us all together under one roof to create something that's. It's not been done in this way before.
You know, it's a bit scary because it's a new category.
You know, it's. Nobody's ever done this, but nobody had ever created a detox program that was put into spa either.
So, you know, I'm. I'm kind of. I do first, but all of my life, I've. I've looked at information, and that's how I created my wellness program.
I looked at what everyone was doing, and I'm a big fan of Rich Anderson, Arise and shine.
And I've done his program. He's passed away now, but I did his program quite a few times, and I really loved it.
And then I studied on Dr. Christopher as well when I was doing my herbalism, and I really loved what he was doing. And I thought, well, hang on a minute. Why don't those. You combine it, you join those two together, because then you get something even more remarkable.
And that's. That's how I'm looking at the world now. Like, let's not be fragmented. Let's bring things together, bring different disciplines together.
And because, you know, you can't just do yoga and expect to always be well, because there's so much more to life than just doing yoga. It's great to stretch the body, but if you. If. If your ph balance is out or you have parasites, then it doesn't matter how much yoga you do, you know, you won't necessarily be the best you can be.
[00:50:46] Speaker B: Ooh, I love that.
That's. That's amazing. It is true. The medical community is so. It's so siloed. I mean, you see it in the addiction world. They Have. Oh, you know, they're finally doing, you know, addiction and co occurring disorders. But for many years, you know, they just said, oh, we put the addicted people here and the people with depression over here. People think that they kind of need to be together because it's. Aren't they related?
[00:51:10] Speaker A: They are related. Well, my son, my son actually works for Paracelsus in.
[00:51:15] Speaker B: Oh yes.
[00:51:16] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. He's, he's an AI storyteller. So he, he works very, very closely with them because they can't advertise, which I think is a crazy situation, you know, because they are really needed. So my son has found ways, using AI storytelling with, you know, real people, but not real, to actually explain how addiction, how it affects families. And you know, the, because it's not just the addicted person, it's. It's the family as well.
And my son and I went to Mauritius and we worked in. I mean this is, this will make you laugh. We worked in a pineapple field and it was a government rehab for heroin addicts.
And it was literally in the middle of a pineapple field. All I could see was pineapples and in the distance this beautiful beach, you know, a Mauritian beach. And so I saw, I saw not only how the addicts were, but I also saw the parents and the heartbreak of what they were going through and the anger of the siblings, you know. So I think Paracelsus is kind of doing that. It's bringing everyone together and, and working for the whole family and not just for. I don't mean to advertise Paracelsus. That sounds terrible, doesn't it? Maybe you cut that bit out.
But you know, I think it's, I think that's what. There are some people who really understand what's happening and they are bringing things together. And I'm very hopeful, you know, because addiction is a terrible thing and it's. There's not just one cause.
[00:52:54] Speaker B: No. And also the whole. In the healthcare industry is not, has not acknowledged that there's such a thing as food addict, like eating food addiction, which I really believe there is.
Sugar is highly addictive.
[00:53:09] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:53:10] Speaker B: And the way we eat is addictive too. I mean, I kind of gobble my food instead of really savoring it. It's one of my issues.
[00:53:17] Speaker A: Chewing 50 times.
[00:53:20] Speaker B: Like my little dog lost 16 teeth recently because if he had periodontal disease, but he just gobbles his food down. And then of course he gets sick because he eats it way too quickly. And I feel like sometimes I don't get sick But I eat wind too quickly and I don't savor it, and I don't take my time.
[00:53:38] Speaker A: Yeah, well, that was another one of Auntie Eileen's famous things is chew your food 50 times.
Okay. So, you know, she'd literally be watching me, just tough, tough lady. And I've been 50 times, Eileen. I'm there. Well done. Well done, dear. You know, so it's just in my head now, so I'm not saying I do it every time, but I do try and consider what I'm taking, you know, and how I'm taking in. And trying not to think about negativity when you're eating.
That's another big one. You know, even if you're just thinking about, you know, when your dog was a puppy and you're eating, it doesn't have to be a big thing, a terribly big joyous thing, but just something that isn't negative because then you're. You're literally swallowing your own negativity as well at the same time.
[00:54:31] Speaker B: So no difficult family discussion while you're eating.
[00:54:34] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:54:35] Speaker B: Always Joy.
[00:54:36] Speaker A: Always Joy. Never discuss problems over dinner.
[00:54:40] Speaker B: Yes.
Well, this is wonderful. So the 15 day trip begins in September, I think. Right.
[00:54:46] Speaker A: If I read correct, September, it's 2027. So it's 2027.
[00:54:51] Speaker B: So it'S not this year.
[00:54:52] Speaker A: Not this year. It will be launched in September this year.
The Oberoi will be marketing it to their people.
And we've got a PR company in New York as well. So hopefully you'll be seeing it in some interesting places. Not necessarily the likes of the glossy magazine.
Well, I feel that it should be more in like the Financial Times, because, you know, that's probably where the people who need it. This isn't a retreat.
It's something very different to that.
[00:55:30] Speaker B: These investment clubs like Tiger 21, I think they could.
[00:55:35] Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. Yes, definitely. Because, you know, when I was a broker, there was 10 of us on the team.
And about three years ago, I saw one of my old colleagues. I hadn't spoken to him for 30 years, and I connected with him and he's like, jeremy, hi. You know, and we were really close and we used to go and buy sandwiches together and things.
And I said, how is everybody else? And he said, they're all dead, Deborah.
And I went, what? He said, yeah, they're all dead. Heart attacks and cancer and addiction.
And I was so shocked because I loved that job. You know, I was very passionate about it. And I thought, wow, that's quite remarkable that out of 10, there's only two of us left, you know, and Jeremy's only 55 and he's had cancer. He had cancer in his jaw, you know, and he changed his life. I mean, there was a lot of addicts as well on the team, you know, like, kept them going and they'd all go out drinking after work. And I had a son. I couldn't.
And one of the things that I noticed is that it was almost like if you didn't join that drinking after work, you were kind of ostracized.
So it's. The whole culture in the financial industry is very, very difficult. It's a difficult world to be in, but, you know, you want to. There's no point making money if you're not going to enjoy it at some point, is there?
[00:57:03] Speaker B: Really good reminder.
[00:57:04] Speaker A: It really is. I spoke to another lady, she worked for Credit Swiss, and she was so upset. She said, you know, I. I earn a fortune. And she was Swiss. She was very, very, you know, straight laced. And she said, I cannot even go and buy a pair of shoes because I have no time, you know, she said, what is the point of this money if I cannot spend it on anything? And, you know, that's kind of where it is. It's kind of that wheel that you keep running, running, running, running, and then you suddenly think, why am I running? You know, what am I running to and from, you know? So Akvita is very much about stopping
[00:57:43] Speaker B: and learning some very, very practical tips on how to bring a healthy lifestyle back into your life.
[00:57:52] Speaker A: Yes. Learning about what your body wants, what your body really needs, not what you think it wants, you know, not what you're a little bit addicted to, who you really are. Yes. Getting down to the. The nitty gritty. Who am I, you know, when everything is changing?
Because change always happens, you cannot escape it.
Who am I still. Who am I when I'm still standing and everything else has fallen apart or I'm on a transition, you know, I've just sold my company. It's like, what am I going to do tomorrow morning when I wake up?
[00:58:28] Speaker B: That is an existential question.
[00:58:30] Speaker A: That really is, isn't it?
[00:58:32] Speaker B: I tell my clients, it's a bit like an artist fixes their blank canvas and they're going, oh, it is.
[00:58:39] Speaker A: You'd have got to slap something on there first.
You know, you've got to make a start. And it's scary. It really is quite scary. So, you know, when you've done something the same all of your life and then suddenly everything falls apart, where do you get Your bravery from, you know. So this gives you bravery because you know yourself incredibly well by the end of it.
[00:59:01] Speaker B: Well, that's wonderful. Well, thank you so much, Deborah, for coming on the show and for giving us such great information.
And we will put the Arc Vitae website into the show. Note. Is there anything else you'd like for us to where people can find you and ask more questions about this?
[00:59:19] Speaker A: You can put my email on there if you have that. It's deborahtvite Life.
I didn't want dot com. I thought no life was more to the point.
But yeah, I'm happy to have any conversations on WhatsApp up Zoom. You know, there's no commitment at all. If you want just talk, then that's absolutely fine because you know, you can't. You can't make a decision about the rest of your life until you at least find out what might be, what might happen.
[00:59:56] Speaker B: Well, it sounds like a wonderful trip. Wish you all the best.
[00:59:59] Speaker A: Thank you so much. Thank you. I've really enjoyed talking to you.
[01:00:05] Speaker B: If this episode landed for you, share it with someone who might need to hear it. And if you haven't already, subscribe so you don't miss what's coming. But here's the real thing. I want you to know if you're carrying something you can't talk about, if you have every resource except someone who actually understands what wealth costs. I work one on one with people like you navigating exactly that.
You can reach me at Diana O E H R L I Com. Thanks for listening.
